The Journey Is The Goal with Manuel Prinz

Michael Dargie (00:00.174) Enjoy this conversation. Manuel (00:01.707) Awesome. Michael Dargie (00:03.214) Are you ready? All right, let's do it Where's my screen there you are. All right. Well, welcome to the rebel rebel I'm your host Michael Dargi and somewhere around the world for me We're gonna find out where please welcome to the show Manuel Prince Manuel. How the heck are you? Manuel (00:04.79) Ready? Manuel (00:20.206) Great Mike, I'm doing great. It's a Friday here in sunny California. So yeah, I couldn't get any better to be honest. Michael Dargie (00:28.758) Yeah, that's fair. I love California. It's my favorite state. Manuel (00:33.44) Yeah, I'm so happy to be on your show today. Initially, I followed you on LinkedIn for a long time. I've been following you. And that's how I got to know about you. was like, hey, this guy's super funny. And then I figured out you have a super cool podcast. that's why I'm super excited to be here today. Great, great. Michael Dargie (00:40.738) Mmm, right Michael Dargie (00:48.878) thanks Manuel. I appreciate that. Michael Dargie (00:56.172) Well, okay, so as much as I love the praise, this is not about me, it's about you. So here's what I'd like you to do, if you could, for the listeners or the people watching. So Manuel, I mean, you're in California, that's awesome. What is it that you do sort of day to day? What's your thing? Manuel (01:16.034) That's a really good question. There is actually quite a few things and no day looks like the other. Just for a quick context of what I'm doing, I'm actually a co-founder of an AI e-commerce startup. do really cool stuff when it comes to all sorts of e-commerce brands. And along those lines, that's what my day to day looks like. Michael Dargie (01:22.06) I love it. Michael Dargie (01:34.414) amazing. Manuel (01:46.124) between product management and expanding to new verticals markets to figuring out really challenging problems and leveraging cutting edge AI technology to get there where we want to be and make our customers and the users happy along the line. Michael Dargie (02:07.276) love it. Can you mention the name of this company or is it Hush Hush Rain? Manuel (02:12.268) Yeah, we are currently in stealth mode, but the cool thing is that we are going public. So we are launching momentarily and yeah, I can definitely disclose the name of the company because it should soon be out there everywhere. Hopefully it's called keep converting. Michael Dargie (02:21.902) Awesome. Michael Dargie (02:28.546) Love it. Amazing. So let's go back in time and I would like to know why you like what happened to Manuel along the way that made you this entrepreneur diving into this AI space, which is a roller coaster. were you like, you five years old growing up wherever you grew up and you're just like, I'm going to run a tech company one day. Manuel (02:54.433) Yeah, that's a really good question. And it was nothing like that, to be honest. And I'm glad I saw both sides. To your question, I went to the US when I first came to the US, was in 2008. But before that, then where I grew up was in Germany. You can probably hear by my accent, I cannot hide it still after 16 years or so in the US. But I grew up in a very... Michael Dargie (02:56.91) you You Michael Dargie (03:18.166) huh. Manuel (03:22.926) rural part of Germany close to the city Stuttgart, which, you know, for those not too familiar with Germany or all its cities, there's tons of towns and whatnot. It's super close to Frankfurt. But Stuttgart is a very, you know, posh industrial town. you know, companies such as Mercedes-Benz, Porsche, Bosch, Siemens, you know, all of them are there. It's like this big engineering type of thing. Michael Dargie (03:33.335) Yeah. Michael Dargie (03:45.23) Yeah. Manuel (03:51.586) That was actually my future, you know, going to school, you know, you become an engineer one day and you know, we will work for one of these cool car manufacturers, which, you know, initially resonated with me because I didn't know any better. Michael Dargie (04:03.064) Yeah. Michael Dargie (04:11.562) All right. that's interesting. Okay. So you're on this trajectory to be an engineer in Stuttgart and I guess what changed? Like why, why the zig? Manuel (04:23.572) Yeah. So to be honest, I did an internship there. Luckily, my dad forced me into an internship because I was like, Hey, I want to quit school. want to start working for these cool car manufacturers right now. So he was like, all right, no, not so quick. Like check out this internship and see that if that's for you. And I was actually working on tooling, you know, like screwing stuff and mechanically working day and night. Like, Michael Dargie (04:48.515) Yeah. Manuel (04:53.262) you know, hard labor type of stuff. That was what the internship was about. I was like, wait, is that the engineering job I'm supposed to do? I was like, maybe that's not for me. I might want to explore some different routes. And that's what was actually a very mind opening experience because I realized the actual mechanical engineering route is not my thing. was not really made for that, to be honest, even though Michael Dargie (04:59.667) Ha Michael Dargie (05:21.496) Yeah Manuel (05:22.7) There's cool things that can be done. It wasn't what I wanted to do. So actually later on in into my studies until then, I still didn't know what I really wanted to do. was like, okay, engineering is not my thing. Let's look into the business side of things. So I started a university for business major econ and as part of that, and that was actually the defining moment. I saw our school collaborates with UC Santa Barbara in California. It was a one-sided exchange and it was somewhere hidden underneath the agenda. No one was really advertising it and no one from my university was going on any exchange because it was just not on the agenda. So I really drilled down to figure out how it works and I contacted that school at UC Santa Barbara and they're like, well, yeah, I mean, sure. I think we once set up something but Michael Dargie (05:55.598) Okay. Manuel (06:18.678) Yeah, let's figure out if you can actually come over and study there for a semester. Long story short, we made it happen. So I came over there and experienced for me the first time, you know, a different side, a different continent, first time in the US and everything was like explosions, know, fireworks for me. Michael Dargie (06:42.518) And you haven't gone back. I mean, you probably, you must go back, see family, I would imagine. Manuel (06:47.286) Yeah, I go see family. They're all still in the old world, which is great. And I miss sometimes like, you know, the grass is always greener, but I'm happy they're still there. I'm very happy I'm here. that's that. No, actually my roommates at university and I'm very thankful for that too. They all came from San Francisco and the Bay Area. So one weekend they actually told me it's like, Hey, you know, this is Santa Barbara. It's like bubble. You know, it's not what everything is about. Michael Dargie (06:59.468) Yeah. Manuel (07:16.728) come with us to San Francisco, check out the city and we introduce you to some forks. And that was actually when I saw Tech, Silicon Valley and everything in between. Michael Dargie (07:29.67) yeah. my God. Okay. What was your, what was your favorite moment going back in time? So you get to this brand new continent. Surely you'd heard about it. You'd heard about California before, not the California continent. I understand, but you know, here you, you arrive in the U S you arrive in California. What was, what's, what's your biggest memory from stepping off that plane? Manuel (07:57.44) Yeah, it's actually when I first got off the plane and I saw how people are getting picked up at the airport with all these big SUVs and every car is super polished. And that's just, again, to my initial background from a car manufacturing perspective. I was like, they're driving the biggest cars, you know, that only a small portion of the people in Europe could ever afford. everyone was like driving that type of car. So that was actually like one of the aha moments. But then later in San Francisco, in the financial district, that's still like branded in my head where I saw, you know, like the investment banker next to, you know, like the skateboarder next to, you know, Michael Dargie (08:29.975) god. Manuel (08:48.994) the homeless on the ground, within the same block that was something still stuck to my head. Like how does these like three worlds combine and exist in one block? That was, yeah, that was really, you know, something I've never seen before. Because you have to understand in Germany, everyone is like leveled, right? Like everyone is... Michael Dargie (09:03.768) That's really cool. Manuel (09:18.68) Kind of like the same middle glass, same trajectory. Some, know, like everyone lives in the same type of house, you know, nothing different. Michael Dargie (09:27.042) Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. And you are like suddenly, you know, in one moment you experience all the different cultures and the economic variants. That's wild. Manuel (09:38.766) Exactly. And that really resonated to me because A1 was an individual, right? A1 was their own person. A1 did their own thing. A1 had their own dreams. A1 was chasing something. A1 was building something. So I was like, wow, this is so cool. It was an environment I really want to further explore. I want to be in that. Michael Dargie (09:54.548) cool. What's your favorite? Michael Dargie (10:02.525) that's so cool. What's your what's your favorite thing that you do on the day to day now? Like what's what's what gets you up in the Manuel (10:09.528) My favorite thing actually is talking to, you know, other companies, other brands, other businesses, because that really helps me to look what's left and right. Because often I get so locked in into my, you know, like day to day and about the product, about our own company growing it, that I forget actually what's, I don't see on a day to day what's left and right. So talking to other, you know, companies, to other entrepreneurs. to other folks, unrelated maybe to what we do, to who our customers are, to get inspiration and to see other sides of the world, the business, life, whatever it is. So that's really my favorite thing. Michael Dargie (10:50.166) Cool. Michael Dargie (10:54.862) Where else have you traveled? Manuel (10:58.262) So when I actually opted in to joining a startup in San Francisco after my studies, so it was a tech startup, I was really fortunate to be on the forefront of growing that globally. And with that, I was able to travel to pretty much every continent and corners of the world because For us as a tech company, we were a sort of a stripe in the early days called payment wall. We actually had every business that was online potentially could have been our customers. So that opened up endless possibilities at that point in time. So to your question, I don't want to brag about it because, you know, know everyone likes to travel and see, but... Michael Dargie (11:30.626) Yeah, yeah. Michael Dargie (11:38.83) you Manuel (11:51.808) I think I've been to over a hundred-ish countries now in the world, which is good and bad. I want to reduce my footprint in terms of CO2, but at the same time, I never wanted to miss any of these opportunities and insights and experiences. Michael Dargie (12:05.197) Yeah Michael Dargie (12:16.236) What's been your favorite country or what's been your favorite place if you had to pick one of your top five? Manuel (12:24.526) Yeah, top five, I would say Vietnam for me, because it was so different to what I've seen at that point before. I've been to other Asian countries and so on. And Japan is for that matter also a very, you know, like developed country, but very different to the Western developed world, I would say. But then Vietnam was in so many ways, the mentality of the people and the food. Michael Dargie (12:27.936) Okay. Michael Dargie (12:32.652) Yeah. Michael Dargie (12:45.24) Sure, yeah, yeah. Manuel (12:52.802) that was still to this day. We had an office there in Vietnam in Hanoi. Every morning we were served from a local chef that we actually had for the team. He went to the market every morning at four or five a.m. bought fish, bought herbs, all these ingredients and cooked the meal like... Michael Dargie (12:56.686) Yeah. Michael Dargie (13:08.184) Yeah. Manuel (13:18.414) Unbelievable. went, I remember that the first day I got there, it's like, okay, now we're going to the office. We were setting up this Hanoi office and then the chef would say like, Hey, here is a fish soup. And I was like, it's 8 AM in the morning, fish soup. With my stomach. And I saw like, he's looking at me like deeply offended. It all was like, okay, what did I do? I was like, no, please. I want to try this, the fish soup. I ate that fish soup. It was like, Michael Dargie (13:33.838) Yeah. Michael Dargie (13:41.432) Yeah. Michael Dargie (13:44.963) Yeah. Manuel (13:47.598) Can I have another serving? It was mind blowing. That's so good. No, from that perspective, I think the people there, super hardworking, super determined, you know, and very sometimes stubborn in a way. I tried to negotiate on the market for something. The person almost like chased me home to the apartment I was living in. was like, okay, you don't negotiate here. You accept what the is. Michael Dargie (13:50.894) Amazing. Michael Dargie (14:01.934) Yeah. Michael Dargie (14:12.174) Interesting. How important do you think it is to for, you know, carbon footprint notwithstanding, how important do think it is for humans to travel to other cultures to experience other places? Manuel (14:28.81) I think it is for, you know, a cultural understanding and for actually valuing who you are and where you're at and, know, what you can do, I think is, is, you know, so, so valuable and everyone, you know, if they have the chance and to some extent or to another, we should do it. have, have two kids and all I want for them to is like experience something similar. just to see a different side of things because it really makes you reflect. I mean, nothing bad with me growing up in my little town in Germany where everything was great. But I would have never seen what's left and right if I would have not done and explored and said, like, now I've been to the US and there's this university I would love to go and go and see it, right? Because... puts things in perspective and it looks makes you look at where you came from or where you were before from a bird's eye perspective. It's like it's also I see I mean news are news and politics are politics. I don't want to go get into that but also from a from a news perspective. I was like listening to the German European news and I thought that's that's it right. That's like what the world looks what it is. I go to the US and look at the news there, it's like, it feels like I'm on a different planet, right? It's like different. Michael Dargie (15:52.335) Yeah, totally. Yeah, I get that. What? So of all the what's the word? Question I'm trying to ask here is When you go to a new place, like so you've traveled like 100 countries, we'll say, what is the one thing that you always do or that you've learned to do every time you land somewhere new? What's your move? What's your learn the culture move or embed yourself move? Manuel (16:22.83) Two things, yeah. I'm glad you asked two things that might not be new to many, like those are two things I think will at least for me get me up to speed in no time. I intentionally, know, book an Uber or get into a taxi and really use that time. And hopefully it's a long enough drive from where I want to go initially, but I really use that time to get me the rundown from. from a taxi driver, it's the best thing ever. Because a taxi driver can give you in like 15 to 20 minutes a complete rundown of what's happening, at least in that city, town, or maybe even the country. It's, you know, invaluable experience. And the second one is, and I love to do that, sometimes it's not possible, but I love to do it. go out at night, usually I try to do that at the first night, depending on when I arrive, and go to a local bar. Michael Dargie (16:59.693) Yeah. Manuel (17:19.586) I go to local setting, maybe there's some street, you know, like a thing going on, whatever it is, and just, you know, go with the flow there, you know, just get, get some food or order a drink at the bar, you know, and just make contact with whoever is there. That also it, it, the cab driver gave me like a good, good idea. And then I think what the, the white spots that have to be filled that I will get that that. Michael Dargie (17:39.053) Yeah. Manuel (17:48.686) point in time. Michael Dargie (17:50.093) love it. What's something that you are going to do, but you haven't done yet? You know, we only have this much time on this crazy spinning blue marble. So what's left for you? Manuel (18:03.65) That's a really good question. And I've been asking myself that every day because there's so much that I still want to do or learn and achieve. I have always a vision to combine the two worlds where I want to be. That's the old world where I came from, plus the new world, which is the US. So far, I haven't been able to really bridge that. Yes, I go travel back to Germany, see family, but like that's only a couple of weeks out of the year. So in a perfect world for me, I would love to combine these two worlds and have, you know, a substantial amount of time, you know, with my family at home and also here where, you know, the business is and where, you know, where my day to day is. So how that would look like. Michael Dargie (18:42.883) Yeah. Michael Dargie (18:53.934) Mm-hmm. Manuel (19:01.858) I'm still trying to figure out how to do that best, but that's actually the next thing on a personal level that I'm trying to achieve while keeping everything running in the flow. Michael Dargie (19:13.528) some balance. Manuel (19:15.264) Exactly. Michael Dargie (19:16.302) Very cool. What's the craziest thing you've ever done? Manuel (19:24.846) craziest thing I've ever done. That's a really good question. I hope no one will throw up when I say that right now. maybe I have to cut that out. When I was in the Philippines, on the island Boracay, it's beautiful. Oh, you've been there? Okay, I'm the same crazy thing that I have. Michael Dargie (19:36.846) Yeah Michael Dargie (19:47.214) I've been there. I've been there. Yeah. Manuel (19:54.446) So someone like a local, you know, who was there running a business, I think a food business, he had like these eggs related things there, you know, looked like an egg and was like, oh, that's kind of like weird. What is that? So he was like, oh, you got to try that. It's like, what do you want me to try? What is it? It's like, yeah, it's called balut. And I was like, wait, balut, is that a balloon or like whatever it is? So he explained to me that it's... Michael Dargie (20:08.078) Yeah. Michael Dargie (20:19.619) Yeah Manuel (20:23.968) A fertilized egg, right? That is, you know, an aphrodisiac for, you know, whatever you want it. And experimental as I am, you know, always trying to do new things and explore and get to know the culture and country and all of that. I obviously had to try it and yeah, I had a colleague with me. She was actually really close to throwing up. She couldn't... Michael Dargie (20:25.433) Yeah. Michael Dargie (20:30.392) Yeah, yeah, yeah, Michael Dargie (20:54.031) You are, you are a brave, brave man. I, I, I am not adventurous when it comes to food and we were at a, at a place where you could have a balloon and I said, no, I just, couldn't do it. Like, so kudos to you. Manuel (21:08.078) Mike, you gotta try it. Honestly, was good. It sounds bad and all of that, but it was good and I felt great afterwards. Michael Dargie (21:14.479) You Yeah. Well, there you go. The aphrodisiac. my goodness. OK, that's really cool. Also cool that you're in Brockeye. That's that's fun. Beautiful beach. Manuel (21:22.153) Yeah, exactly. Manuel (21:30.284) Yeah, when did you go there? Maybe you had some overlap. Michael Dargie (21:35.619) before the pandemic and I'd have to say like probably eight years ago. was just before they closed the island down. They closed it down for about a year to solve some of the plumbing issues they had. Manuel (21:50.062) Oh, yeah, yeah, I heard about that. yeah, I was in 2014 or 15. Yeah. Michael Dargie (21:57.609) okay. We would have been after that. Yeah. Probably like 2018 maybe give or take. My, what a, what a wild time though. And flying into Cebu was quite something. I'm not sure how you got there, but it was a whole, whole different experience. We took my son who lived in the Philippines for five, six years. He said, dad, when you get there, you have to like take the trike. Manuel (22:03.054) I see, it would have been too funny if we were at the same food stand and fighting while I fish. Michael Dargie (22:27.375) Don't take the hotel bus. You got to take the trike. So we're just like, okay. So we ended up taking this little, I forget what they're called, but it's like a motorcycle with sort of a carts attached to it with duct tape. Manuel (22:41.12) I know exactly what you're talking about. These things are so cool, but they are kind of... yeah. I don't know. They are safe. Michael Dargie (22:45.743) Anyways, yeah, so we went that way. We went all the way to our hotel on one of these things, took the little ferry boat across and on the other side got back into this thing. And I swear to God, we were gonna get killed. It was an incredible experience, lots of stories, but my goodness, talk about a different world. Manuel (23:06.254) Yeah, to your point when you said you landed in Cebu or like took a plane from there, did you also have one of these like propeller planes and... I barely made the landing. Michael Dargie (23:16.103) Yeah. Like sideways. Yeah, so fun. Wow. What is this? What scares the hell out of you? Manuel (23:30.35) What's the hell out of me? That is a good question. Let me think about this. Michael Dargie (23:39.063) Okay, take your time. Manuel (23:43.758) I mean, if I have to relate it back to animals, what scares the... The hack out of me is like when I see a rat or a mouse, you know, I scream like a little baby. That definitely scares the hack out of me. I don't know what it is, but over the years it got even worse. Luckily, I don't see too many around. I hope it stays that way, but you know... But as humans, as mice and rats, that scares the heck out of me. Michael Dargie (24:05.411) hilarious. Michael Dargie (24:12.928) that's so- Manuel (24:12.93) But honestly, other side note, and it's not really scary, but I realized once it happens is when I have nothing to do or try to do nothing. I realized that I'm getting anxious to a point where was like, okay, now I need to keep myself busy. Michael Dargie (24:29.487) you Manuel (24:38.624) So it's funny, my wife always says that on vacation I need at least two to three days to settle a little bit. So then to be actually at vacation because before that I've just tried to keep myself busy. Yeah, yeah. I'm sure you are the same way because all the things that you do, you have to be on your toes constantly. At least that's what it is like from an external perspective. Michael Dargie (24:53.441) Yeah, you're like a shark. You gotta keep swimming. Michael Dargie (25:04.836) Yeah. Michael Dargie (25:08.151) Yeah, I don't like to stay still at all. Yeah. Manuel (25:11.167) Bad yeah, you the same same people there Michael Dargie (25:14.975) Yeah, totally. Where's the place that you want to travel to you haven't gone yet? Like is there a place on your list you're just like, I totally got to go to Banff. Manuel (25:27.126) Yeah, yeah. And I was just talking about that with a friend of mine because he's going to move to Australia. And I've never been to Australia. So let's go. Michael Dargie (25:35.981) Yes Me either Michael Dargie (25:42.479) All right. Australia. Yeah, they're like they're they're our cousins. They're like they're our sister country, Canada and Australia. We're like we're same Z's, but they're upside down. Yeah. Manuel (25:53.556) Yeah, you have best buddies. mean, it's funny that you've never been there either, but that's really on my bucket list. It's always been on my bucket list, but I mean, it's so far away and nothing had aligned from any perspective for me to go, but yeah. Michael Dargie (26:09.582) Yeah Well, one day maybe you'll see. You don't know. You look like a pretty fit guy. Looks like you get out at least for walks. Probably you're probably like maybe you're a runner. I don't know. Maybe you're like a triathlete. I don't know. But a picture, picture if you will. Let's say you're out for a walk and I don't know if you have a favorite place to go for a walk clear your head. Manuel (26:27.33) things that makes you feel better, know, after sitting on my desk for a week. Michael Dargie (26:40.983) and maybe there's a favorite time of day. I'm just gonna make this up. Let's say it's along the ocean. And if you're in the Bay Area, maybe it's along the boardwalk there, I'm not sure. And maybe it's late afternoon. You know, it's not oppressively hot, still nice and humid, it's pleasant. And you're sitting there thinking to yourself, Manuel, I wish the world knew this one thing. What is the one thing that you wish the world knew? Manuel (27:09.006) Amazing question that I was just thinking about that, you know the other day I think what the world maybe doesn't know is that the Journey is the goal It sounds so you know cliche, but the journey is the goal. There's no end state of anything Michael Dargie (27:30.979) Hahaha! Manuel (27:32.876) I have seen myself like until now trying to chase things and I was like, if I accomplish this and that and that, you know, and similar to your question, what you had earlier, you know, what is it that I want to achieve or where go or what's next? I kind of like learned to really embrace going or like working towards something, you know, trying to, you know, achieve steps or getting closer to where you want. then You know, embrace that along the way because often and throughout my career too, it's like, ah, you know, going to the office every day and doing this, it's like, it's boring. I don't want it. It's like, it's BS, right? But when I approach it with a different mindset, it's like, hey, that's the journey. It's part of the journey. You know, embrace it, take whatever you can out of it. You know, even if it might be the most stupid. Michael Dargie (28:16.505) Yeah. Michael Dargie (28:23.033) Yeah. Manuel (28:30.83) task that you see or have to do, like try to figure out what can you get personally out of that or something that makes it worthwhile. And that's how I look at things. often I have a feeling and I see myself there too, you know, I have to remind myself constantly about that too. But I feel like people are chasing things, you know, and hoping when they reach a certain step, they will be in the state of you know, complete happiness, you know, this never exists, right? The human being is not made for that. yeah, I mean, that's what I, you know, personally found out that if I approach things and look at the world with that, with that mindset, everything, you know, can be great. Michael Dargie (29:03.799) Yeah Michael Dargie (29:25.261) love that. That's amazing. I feel bad even asking a second question. It's not even really a follow up question, but that was so perfect. But there's these people in the world, I call them rebels in waiting. And if you imagine for a second, it could be, you know, Manuel back in the day in Stuttgart, and deciding to he wants to go to an American school, or he wants to, you know, broaden his horizons. Back in that time, you were a rebel in waiting. You're just in that in-between moment of, you know, between wanting and doing. And what I'm wondering is what advice do you have for others that are in between wanting and doing? Manuel (30:08.384) Yeah, good one. Good one as well. Every time you want to do something or you have some idea, that idea or that something is in your head, I believe for a reason. If that thought or whatever you want to do persists in your head, even if you sleep at night and it's still there, Michael Dargie (30:11.108) You Michael Dargie (30:26.093) Yeah. Manuel (30:36.866) It's there for a reason. When you then try to figure out like, how can I get that thought out of my head by talking it bad? It's like, oh, no, because I have a reason to not do it or no, it might not work because of XYZ. Then you talk to other people and they're telling you the same thing. Then you feel empowered not to do it. I think that's a trap that a lot of people fall into. Michael Dargie (30:52.867) Yeah. Manuel (31:05.59) You know, so it sounds so stupid and often, you know, it's the easiest thing to actually do. It's like, just do it. Just do it. If you have something in your head, like go chase it as there's nothing else that, you know, is there for you to do. It's funny because my mom always tells me back in the days, it's like, it's just like, I never, I gave up to... Michael Dargie (31:06.338) Yeah. Michael Dargie (31:16.131) Yes. Michael Dargie (31:26.723) I love it. Manuel (31:34.84) Vince you from not doing something because I knew once you had an idea, was like zero point in talking you out of it because you just go and do it. But I wasn't always like that. It came over time. It came over time when I really pushed through it with whatever you do. mean, founding your own business too. That's the best example. Michael Dargie (31:42.095) Yeah Michael Dargie (31:58.34) Yeah. Manuel (32:00.526) Like you would probably like find a thousand people that tell you no not to do it because XYZ will not work. And you start to believe that if you listen to that. Yeah, it doesn't hurt to get advice. Don't get me wrong. I don't want to say that never get advice and just do it like stupidly. No, I mean, I have a solid assessment but if a thought is stuck in your head and it doesn't go away then... Michael Dargie (32:06.381) Yeah, absolutely. Michael Dargie (32:19.417) Yeah. Manuel (32:27.586) There's only one way to figure it out. You got to go for it. Yeah, you might run against the wall. It happens. But so it, right? Michael Dargie (32:33.858) Yeah, totally. That's awesome. Do you have words that you live by? Do you have a personal motto? Like, I'll give you an example. Like mine is to do cool and weird shit with cool and weird people. Like that's my mantra. If I'm not doing that, then I feel like I'm doing something wrong. So do you have something like that that's your star? Manuel (32:59.34) Yeah, yeah. me, it's like never stop running. Never stop running. you know, that can also be meant literally, you it's like, you said, you said I look like a runner, I wish I would be, you know, it's like, I run a little bit, but not like for miles. I think, I think if... Michael Dargie (33:22.398) Yeah. Manuel (33:27.342) If one day for me I stop running, then that would be the end date. And I never want to get there. Maybe if you interview me 20 years from now, I would say like, I stopped. I always want to keep going because that's... Michael Dargie (33:39.501) Yeah. Michael Dargie (33:44.703) Can we just stop? Manuel (33:57.282) What drives me and I love yours. I should maybe polish mine up to make this sound so much cooler like yours. Michael Dargie (34:07.295) There is man. Well, this has been awesome. I've had so much fun Where can people learn more about you and connect with you? We'll put it all down in the show notes Manuel (34:16.81) Yeah, perfect. mean, LinkedIn is probably the best thing for me at this point. Manual prints, I post, not frequently, but I do. And I love to chat with people. But also, yeah, I'm around, I make myself available throughout. I go to a lot of meetups, conferences, in any space. Michael Dargie (34:42.233) Nice. Manuel (34:46.506) So, and yeah, maybe in one of the random cat tries from the airport, you know, to the next spot or at the local bar, you know, where I'm trying to get more information. Maybe there I run into someone. Hopefully you too. I'll see you in Australia. That's where I meet you. Michael Dargie (34:55.523) Yes. Michael Dargie (35:04.727) That's awesome. Yeah, sounds perfect. I'll see you there. Manuel (35:11.375) Great! Michael Dargie (35:14.767) Dude, that was awesome. That was so good. my God. What a great show. Manuel (35:21.214) Nice, hey thank you so much, you asked really good questions. Yeah, you asked really good questions. Michael Dargie (35:24.907) thanks. Yeah. Thank you. I mean, you give really great answers. So I mean, it just begs more questions. You make it easy. Manuel (35:31.746) Whoa. Michael Dargie (35:37.995) This will come out in about a month or so, give or take. And yeah, I'll make sure that you get all the links. I'd love to stay in touch. And for real, I will get to Australia one of these days. Maybe I'll see you there. Manuel (35:41.515) Amazing. Manuel (35:50.08) Yeah, do you have a spot where you would love to go or just across the country? Michael Dargie (35:56.207) No, really, you know, shamelessly, I know very little about it. You know, like I know I want to go to Melbourne and Sydney. I know I want to hit the Great Barrier Reef. I want to do some scuba diving, want to do some surfing, want to do some motorcycle riding. I want to try not to die from all the animals that can kill me there. You know. Yeah, so I don't I don't know. I like I yeah, I know people down there. Manuel (36:17.614) It's true, yeah, that's a point. Michael Dargie (36:26.263) So it's just, yeah, I just want to, I'd like to experience it. Manuel (36:30.646) Yeah, so actually from a Canadian standpoint, you actually can just live there, Live and work, right? It's some sort of a golden visa situation. Michael Dargie (36:37.443) Yeah, I think so. Michael Dargie (36:41.487) Yeah, some sort of, yeah, some sort of crazy, especially now there's a whole new thing now that's happening because of all the crazy stuff that's Pardon me in the world in the US right now. But yeah, Canada and Australia have really sort of come together. Same thing with the UK. And I think I can get it. My people are from Scotland, like two generations ago, and I think I can I can still get citizenship if I want it. Manuel (37:06.492) Manuel (37:12.365) Canada allowed a dual citizenship? I mean, know, like it's always good to have options. This is great. Yeah, I know that the EU is currently in discussions with Australia to have some like dual visa situation, you know, for Michael Dargie (37:14.957) Yeah, yeah, yeah, with the UK. Yeah. Right. So good. my God. Michael Dargie (37:39.055) Hmm. Manuel (37:39.15) everyone to live and work for an extended period of time, know, either in the EU or Australia, vice versa. It's not decided yet, but it sounds like it's going that direction. Michael Dargie (37:51.673) Yeah, it feels that way. We get a lot of Australians come up here. Like I'm in Calgary, which is just outside of the Rockies. So we're like lot of Australians in Canmore and Banff and like all the ski resorts. And even we like so my girlfriend and I, just spent 10 days on the Pacific Rim, a place called Yaclulit or Tofino on Vancouver Island. And man, you couldn't throw a stick without hitting an Australian down there like because it's a big surf town. Manuel (37:59.009) Nice. Manuel (38:20.846) Do you surf? Michael Dargie (38:22.189) So, yeah, not well. Yeah, I don't surf well. I have surfed. I love surfing, but yeah, I'm not a good surfer. Manuel (38:32.754) Nice, nice. Yeah, I'm not a good server too, but I like to surf. My friends were dragging me when I lived in San Francisco to, know, Steamer Lane, which is apparently, I'm not sure if you heard of it, but it's one of the craziest, right? Like, well known. And that was my first experience surfing. I literally almost died. Michael Dargie (38:44.216) wow. Michael Dargie (38:48.471) Yeah, that's... Michael Dargie (38:57.187) you Manuel (38:57.272) They made me jump off the cliff to get into that wave, right? With the longboard, the Costco longboard, the wave storm. Michael Dargie (39:01.815) my God. my God. Well, I'm glad you're still alive. Manuel (39:09.94) Yeah, but yeah, nothing will shock me anymore. in terms of surfing, unless there's a white shark or whatever trying to attack me. Michael Dargie (39:11.823) Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, fair enough. Hilarious. my God. Yeah. You've lived a good life. So far so good. Manuel (39:26.094) Well, I mean, it sounds like you too. You have been to a lot of sports from where it's... How many countries have you visited? Michael Dargie (39:33.711) Oh, nowhere near what you have. Like maybe maybe a dozen. Like. Yeah, like, yeah, maybe maybe a dozen on the outside, but there's so much more of the world to see. But yeah, finding the time I want to get down to South America is sort of the next the next place I want to hit. I'd like to see more of Asia. I'd like to spend time in Japan would be really good. And now that you mention it, like Vietnam is on the list. Like when we were when we were in the Philippines, it was like a quick flight away. We just didn't have the time when we were there to, you know, hit all the places we wanted to. Manuel (40:16.302) That's actually what I did. was, because we had an office in Manila, the Philippines, right, for like customer service and so on. I was actually setting that up and as part of that, because I was extended periods of time in the Philippines. So from there, I would just fly to Vietnam, to Singapore, to Japan. I mean, it's so close, right? Michael Dargie (40:29.795) Nice. Michael Dargie (40:35.327) yeah, so cool. Yeah, we went and saw my son. He was living in Manila. He was like it with a fintech company and we went to go see him during Easter, which was crazy. They really take their Easter seriously. Like they like they were literally nailing people to the cross. Like it was fucking crazy. Manuel (40:47.431) I know. Manuel (40:56.494) Wait, that's so cool that your Sadler is still there in Manila. Michael Dargie (41:00.075) No, no, he so yeah, he was there for five six years ended up meeting his now wife there And they moved to the uk She finished, her masters in fashion in in london Then they moved to scotland abradean for a while then they came back to canada. They've been here ever since Manuel (41:23.506) Nice. Nice. So he has the UK citizenship sounds like. Michael Dargie (41:29.505) No, no, he doesn't. Yeah, but I think we're all going to end up going for it. Just, know, you know, me and the boys. Manuel (41:39.448) Good, yeah, for sure. That's what I did too. I did the dual one first, like obviously the German and then the US one. My sons too, they applied for the German one because they were born here in the US. like, it's, yeah, I mean, too early already. It's good to have options. Who knows, you know, like if they blow up some parts of the world with all this BS that's happening, then it's like... Michael Dargie (41:47.854) Nice. Michael Dargie (41:59.383) Absolutely. Michael Dargie (42:08.016) Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Different conversation, different podcast, different podcasts. Hey, let me I'm going to hit stop on this to make sure I get the upload. Manuel (42:09.397) Yeah, different story. Yeah, exactly.